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Post by aquacultured on Dec 3, 2018 0:31:40 GMT 1
Racism or xenophobia, which is how they like to elide the immigration question, had nothing to do with it, as follow-up focus group investigations, even in the most white of working-class Labour constituencies, have insisted over and over again (which is why Corbyn is now so sanguine about abandoning the issue.) What, you haven't taken into account the effect of the fact that racism is illegal?
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 3, 2018 0:37:21 GMT 1
Racism or xenophobia, which is how they like to elide the immigration question, had nothing to do with it, as follow-up focus group investigations, even in the most white of working-class Labour constituencies, have insisted over and over again (which is why Corbyn is now so sanguine about abandoning the issue.) What, you haven't taken into account the effect of the fact that racism is illegal? Jeez. look Aqua, old fella, I've had probably more than my fair share tonight, I'll admit it for once. It's...whatever day of the week it is. It's Christmas. Have pity. Please explain wtf you might mean. Just, like, as a sort of favour - I'll maybe owe you one.
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Post by aquacultured on Dec 3, 2018 0:45:51 GMT 1
A question for aqua - or any other remainers who may be awake. If the referendum had voted 51% remain, would you consider the result democratically illegitimate? Why not? I was contrasting May's non-majority with another non-majority situation. Regardless of what mrsonde says, it's unknown for a PM to become PM without around 40%+ of the votes. It's possible, of course, but only if there's a robust three-way reasonably even contest.
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 3, 2018 0:49:26 GMT 1
A question for aqua - or any other remainers who may be awake. If the referendum had voted 51% remain, would you consider the result democratically illegitimate? Why not? I was contrasting May's non-majority with another non-majority situation. Regardless of what mrsonde says, it's unknown for a PM to become PM without around 40%+ of the votes. It's possible, of course, but only if there's a robust three-way reasonably even contest. So? Our system more or less precludes such a possibility, that's all. Plenty of other systems virtually guarantee it. We're better off for such an arrangement, I personally believe. This says nothing about the nature of democracy.
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 3, 2018 0:54:04 GMT 1
What, you haven't taken into account the effect of the fact that racism is illegal? Aaaah! The penny drops. Maybe. I believe you might mean that these focus-group interviewees have been subdued enough by possible legal incrimination to express contrary views to what they actually believe? Well, what they clearly said was that even if the Labour Party somehow negotiated a "deal" whereby free Movement was null and void, and immigration could therefore be controlled - we get back "control of our borders" - then they would still not wish to remain in the EU. No legal implications. That's what they believe. Their enmity towards the EU is nothing to do with immigration. It's about resentment at being exploited by a class of people totally beyond any ability they once marginally possessed to influence or restrain - the class of people you once belonged to, and still clearly identify with, and profit thereby. In contrast, these are Working people. People whose labour really earns the country's wealth - its purchasing power, rather than its "money". They're fed up with being pushed around, fed a pittance, whilst the middle-class elite who do the pushing extract ever-increasing slices of the value of their labour and waltz around the capitals of the world in limousines, issuing edicts on what they can and can not do.
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Post by alancalverd on Dec 3, 2018 1:11:47 GMT 1
It is important to remember that the prime minister is not elected, but invited by the Queen as the person most likely to command a majority in parliament. Hence Alec Douglas-Home was appointed PM when in the House of Lords. So there's nothing inherently undemocratic about TM becoming PM.
Taking back control of the UK's borders means treating all would-be immigrants on the basis of personal merit, and not giving automatic preference to any unworthy scum who happen to come from a parasite nation in Europe. How can giving equal oppportunity to Asians, Africans and Europeans be considered racist?
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 3, 2018 1:18:14 GMT 1
Keep all unworthy scum out, I say, wherever they're from. Nothing racist about that. I'd keep Ed Sheeran out, and he's just ginger. That woman who's the unfortunate wife of Ed Balls - Yvette Cooper? She can go, she irritates the hell out of me.
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 3, 2018 1:25:44 GMT 1
Yeah! The Queen! She's the first I'd keep out. Closely followed by her first offspring. I wouldn;t even let them set foot on our overseas territories, in case they tried to squat. Then there's Claudia Winkleman. Who let her in?
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 3, 2018 2:28:22 GMT 1
But I don't want to seem sexist. I'm a man admittedly - what can I say? But - Philip Schofield. Say. I know he's popular, for some reason, but I'd kick his butt from here to next week. Jon Snow. Here's a useful educational tool you fellas might like to teach your grandchildren, when they're playing up. Jon Snow was never shown this lesson, which is why he's grown up to be the f*#ker he is. You take your right hand and fold the first and middle fingers into an open V-shape. Use this clever formation to firmly - but not too firmly - grasp their little noses. Then, when they've fully realised the inescapability of their predicament - a judicious increase of pressure upon any given sign of resistance might be required to impress this condition - raise your left hand so that it's held above the level of your extended right forearm, still comfortably restraining the said nasal protuberances. At this point the aforesaid younger folk will usually meet your gaze, in that foolishly trusting way middle-class young children often still retain. Then, firmly and apparently violently bring your left hand smacking down on your right forearm, with as loud an impact as you can tolerate. Of course, at the same time, release the grip of your extended folded fingers upon the aforementioned noses. Your hand will thus be pushed down from their previously imprisoned nose, but without any lasting detrimental effect on the child, other than profound and wondering shock, and appropriate and lifelong lasting awe. An additional but not strictly required elaboration of this technique requires your immediately pushing the tip of your thumb through the two fingers that previously gripped the nose, and waving it front of the child's boogling eyes, conveying the momentary illusion that you have in fact by your unprecedented and apparently incomprehensible senseless violence removed their nose from their previously pristine faces. This trick only works in my experience, if my niece and nephew are any guide, before they're about five or six -after that they've somehow wised up to the illusion.
Very gratifying. Further parental and grandfatherly advice is available on my website.
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Post by aquacultured on Dec 4, 2018 0:41:40 GMT 1
alan, I don't see how you can talk about the Queen at the same time as democracy.
I think the queen is lovely (much as mrsonde is in Nay's eyes).
She also has a terrible power.
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 4, 2018 5:10:40 GMT 1
Oh ffs. What a way to start your day. The infantilising power of social media. Put him out of his misery Nay for crissakes, he's feeling neglected.
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 4, 2018 5:32:08 GMT 1
"Previously, on Buffy the Vampire Slayer..."
aqua (in Willow the drippy teenage witch mode):
mrsonde (in Spike the evil but strangely alluring vampire mode):
[Spike sprouts a knobbly forehead, vulpine eyes, and vampiric fangs...but Willow is saved from having her throat ripped out, yet again, by the cerebral controlling microchip the Government have implanted in his cortex, which restrains him, much to his frustration, in his loveable and deeply sexually magnetic mrsonde persona. He stumbles out in rage and electronically induced pain through the open window.]
aqua (still mooning about in not so strangely neglected and unattractive Willow mode);
nay (entering through the open window, dressed in black, in his broodingly dangerous, but occasionally sappy, Angelis mode):
[Angel departs back through the window, with a swirl of his ankle-length leather coat and brooding but somehow strangely sympathetic scowl. Willow looks after him, longingly, and dribbles a bit.]
[Cue the music, roll credits...]
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Post by alancalverd on Dec 4, 2018 9:53:37 GMT 1
alan, I don't see how you can talk about the Queen at the same time as democracy. I think the queen is lovely (much as mrsonde is in Nay's eyes). She also has a terrible power. It is worth noting that the countries with the highest ratings for citizen happiness in Europe are all monarchies. The words that used to strike terror into the hearts of republicans were "President Blair" but even that curse seems to have been Trumped. For as long as our elected representatives behave like childish masters rather than adult servants, it is vital that they should be answerable to someone who is above politics and has a genuine interest in the longterm good of the country. Yes, she has a terrible power: to pardon anyone and to dissolve an ineffective parliament. Long may she reign.
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 4, 2018 17:40:17 GMT 1
alan, I don't see how you can talk about the Queen at the same time as democracy. I think the queen is lovely (much as mrsonde is in Nay's eyes). She also has a terrible power. It is worth noting that the countries with the highest ratings for citizen happiness in Europe are all monarchies. The words that used to strike terror into the hearts of republicans were "President Blair" but even that curse seems to have been Trumped. For as long as our elected representatives behave like childish masters rather than adult servants, it is vital that they should be answerable to someone who is above politics and has a genuine interest in the longterm good of the country. Yes, she has a terrible power: to pardon anyone and to dissolve an ineffective parliament. Long may she reign. alancalverd (in his redeemed-demon mode of perfectly sensible and possibly even profoundly rational Englisman): Tony Wedgwood-Benn? Hang the treacherous scoundrel! marchesarosa (in her deeply sexy Watcher mode): He's dead already Mister Calverd - it would be a pointless act of vengeful administrative redundancy, even for a communist.
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Post by mrsonde on Dec 5, 2018 0:45:27 GMT 1
jean (materialising through the wall, her finger pointedly accusing):
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