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Post by Progenitor A on Apr 23, 2018 7:05:09 GMT 1
Alarmed at the rise of European States power, in 1712, Ibrahim Muteferrika, an Ottoman statesman, presented the Sultan with the question :
'Why do Christian nations, in the past so weak,, now dominate so many lands and so often defeat Ottoman forces in the field of battle?'
His answer to this question included, European parliamentary systems,, Christian world-wide expansionism,European centres of learning and European law-making based upon 'reason and logic, whilst Islam was held back by Sharia Law'
Islam could only progress to equal Europe, he considered, if it adopted the European Enlightenment and scientific revolution
In fact it took another 200 years before Turkey adopted these pillars of western progress, when Kemal Ataturk abolished Ottoman dress, abolished Sharia law, introduced the European alphabet to replace Arabic, and established European style centres of learning
And now today we have demands in European Cities for the introduction of Sharia law – one of the major factors in the backwardness of Islamic states (in the words of an Ottoman statesman), and Turkey itself is now re-asserting Sharia Law
Will Europe go the way of Islam, choosing religious prejudice over rationality in law-making and adopting Sharia law to placate its increasing Moslem population?
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Post by fascinating on Apr 23, 2018 17:42:29 GMT 1
For the UK, the independent review of the application of sharia law stated that "Sharia councils have no legal status and no legal binding authority under civil law. Whilst sharia is a source of guidance for many Muslims, sharia councils have no legal jurisdiction in England and Wales. Thus if any decisions or recommendations are made by a sharia council that are inconsistent with domestic law (including equality policies such as the Equality Act 2010) domestic law will prevail. It is important to note that sharia councils are not courts and they should not refer to their members as judges. It is this misrepresentation of sharia councils as courts that leads to public misconceptions over the primacy of sharia over domestic law and concerns of a parallel legal system. ". The report gave 3 recommendations, the first that Islamic marriages should be, by law, brought into line with Christian and Jewish marriages, meaning that there must be civil registration of the marriage at the same time as the religious marriage ceremony; second "that cultural change is required within Muslim communities so that communities acknowledge women’s rights in civil law, especially in areas of marriage and divorce. Awareness campaigns, educational programmes and other similar measures should be put in place to educate and inform women of their rights and responsibilities"; third, the setting up of a body to regulate sharia councils. www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/678478/6.4152_HO_CPFG_Report_into_Sharia_Law_in_the_UK_WEB.pdf
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Post by jonjel on Apr 25, 2018 12:16:17 GMT 1
For the UK, the independent review of the application of sharia law stated that "Sharia councils have no legal status and no legal binding authority under civil law. Whilst sharia is a source of guidance for many Muslims, sharia councils have no legal jurisdiction in England and Wales. Thus if any decisions or recommendations are made by a sharia council that are inconsistent with domestic law (including equality policies such as the Equality Act 2010) domestic law will prevail. It is important to note that sharia councils are not courts and they should not refer to their members as judges. It is this misrepresentation of sharia councils as courts that leads to public misconceptions over the primacy of sharia over domestic law and concerns of a parallel legal system. ". The report gave 3 recommendations, the first that Islamic marriages should be, by law, brought into line with Christian and Jewish marriages, meaning that there must be civil registration of the marriage at the same time as the religious marriage ceremony; second "that cultural change is required within Muslim communities so that communities acknowledge women’s rights in civil law, especially in areas of marriage and divorce. Awareness campaigns, educational programmes and other similar measures should be put in place to educate and inform women of their rights and responsibilities"; third, the setting up of a body to regulate sharia councils. www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/678478/6.4152_HO_CPFG_Report_into_Sharia_Law_in_the_UK_WEB.pdfAll eminently sensible and overdue. But when is this likely to happen, if at all as these are only recommendations.
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Post by fascinating on Apr 25, 2018 20:07:14 GMT 1
The report only came out this year. The government has said that it won't adopt the 3rd recommendation because that would give legitimacy to the Sharia Councils. For the rest, the Home Office is considering them.
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Post by Progenitor A on Apr 28, 2018 9:47:45 GMT 1
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Post by mrsonde on Apr 28, 2018 16:30:10 GMT 1
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Post by mrsonde on Apr 28, 2018 16:38:45 GMT 1
The report only came out this year. The government has said that it won't adopt the 3rd recommendation because that would give legitimacy to the Sharia Councils. For the rest, the Home Office is considering them. You've probably selectively truncated this quote, for whatever reason. As it stands, it's straw man argumentation, a blatant piece of politically correct misdirection. No one afaik has ever argued or "misrepresented" that sharia courts have superior weight than English law, or that they have any "jurisdiction". It is not "the public" that are so misled, but, overwhelmingly, muslim women. To pretend otherwise, as this quote appears to do, sweeps all the wholly justified anxieties about this issue under a PC blanket of utter deceit.
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Post by fascinating on Apr 29, 2018 13:32:58 GMT 1
I have given a link to the whole report, which you can therefore read in full yourself. I tried to summarise the recommendations, in the belief that most people would want to know the most important points. If there are any important points I have missed then feel free to quote them. The fact that muslim women are being misled is specifically addressed in the recommendation for awareness campaigns and educational programmes to be directed at muslim communities.
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Post by mrsonde on May 1, 2018 17:56:58 GMT 1
I have given a link to the whole report, which you can therefore read in full yourself. I tried to summarise the recommendations, in the belief that most people would want to know the most important points. If there are any important points I have missed then feel free to quote them. The fact that muslim women are being misled is specifically addressed in the recommendation for awareness campaigns and educational programmes to be directed at muslim communities. The "communities" are well aware of it already. To effectively address this problem you'd need an army of advisors to go into every muslim home and spend a few hours talking to the women, in private and in confidence, listening to their problems and giving them legal advice with an advocacy directed at their concerns from the point of view of the English legal system. Or, to save all that public money, you could instead let the legal system deal with it, like it does everyone else who lives in this country?
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